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Posted
Last week I had my first encounter with a motor sparking during start that was later determined to be "normal" (not associated with any destructive condition). So I wanted to share the experience and what we learned.

It was a 1000 hp 3600 rpm 4kv Open Drip Proof (ODP) vertical squirrel cage induction motor. The top of the motor is about 10' above floor leve(coupling is about 3' above floor leve). An operator saw a spark come out of the top of the motor during start and glow as it fell all the way to the floor. Inspection of the floor afterwards showed nothing left of the spark. The area where the spark was said to have came out of the motor was actually the air inlet. There was no smell of smoke. There were no abnormal noises noted.

The motor was immediately stopped as a precaution under the suspicion that this might be an electrical winding fault.

Review of industry documents indicate that (in addition to winding faults and rotor/stator contact), sparking can occur during starting due to normal movement of rotor bars in slots, and the occurrence of sparking can increase if rotor bars are degrading. See the following quotes:
quote:
Motor Root Cause Analysis by Electrical Apparatus Services Association, 2002
"ROTOR SPARKING:
There are several potential causes of rotor sparking on fabricated rotors. Some are of a nondestructive nature, and some can lead to rotor failure. Nondestructive sparking can and probably does occur during normal motor operation. Such sparking is seldom observed due to its low intensity and/or the motor enclosure prohibits its observance. Normal operation can be defined as any condition that could subject the motor to voltage dips, load fluctuation, switching disturbances, etc. Sparking usually is not observed while running at full load. The centrifugal force at full-load speed is usually greater than the electromagnetic forces acting on the bar, due to rated load current, and tends to displace and hold the bar radially in the slot.
Furthermore, the frequency within the rotor circuit is very low (equal to the slip frequency). This low frequency corresponds to a low impedance of the rotor cage circuit, essentially confining all rotor current to the cage itself. Therefore, while possible, sparking is not normally observed during operation at full load and speed.

During across-the-line starting, however, the current in the rotor cage can be 5 to 7 times normal. This high current combined with the higher cage impedance, due to the frequency of the rotor current initially decaying from line frequency at standstill, will cause a voltage drop along the length of the bar in excess of 6 times the normal running value. This voltage tends to send current through the laminations. In effect, during start-up, there are actually two parallel circuits—one through the rotor bar, and the other through the laminations. The magnetic forces created by the high current flow during start-up cause the rotor bars to vibrate at a decaying frequency, starting at line frequency, which produces a force at twice line frequency. This tangential vibration within the confines of the rotor slot causes intermittent interruptions of the current flow between the bars and various portions of the laminations with resultant visible arcing. The rotor design and manufacturing processes include measures intended to reduce sparking. However, material and manufacturing tolerances, together with the effects of differential thermal expansion and thermal cycling, preclude any motor from “sparkless” operation. Even identical or duplicate motors can and will exhibit differing levels of spark intensity, since all component parts have tolerances and are thermally cycled during operation.

The sparks observed in the air gap are actually very small particles of bar and/or core iron, heated to incandescence by current passing through the iron-bar boundary. Initial punching burrs and/or particles of bar material removed during installation can generally be expected to decrease after several starts. However, particles generated by intermittent sparking due to bar motion will not decrease during the life of the motor.

The brief period of intensified sparking that can occur during starting is not detrimental to motor life. Motors with more than 20 years of operation have shown only slight etching of the rotor bars at areas of contact with the core iron when disassembled.

Destructive sparking can occur under several circumstances, the most common being a broken bar or a defective bar-to-end ring connection. Bars usually break near where the bar connects to the end ring. Breakage is preceded by radial cracks starting either in the top or bottom of the bar. While sparking caused by fatigue failure of the rotor bar is usually greater in intensity than that previously mentioned, it is still difficult to visually detect since the majority of motor enclosures prevent “line of sight” visual observation of the air gap. Common methods of determining whether sparking is caused by broken bars or end ring connections are:
• Visual inspection of the rotor assembly.
• Tapping the bars with a small hammer. Broken bars
have a dull sound, like a cracked bell. For loose bars,
tap one end of bar while feeling the opposite end for
movement.
• Current pulsation when the motor is under load.
• Single-phase rotational test.
• Growler test.
• Motor current signature analysis.
• Observed noise (rattling sound) during starting cycle.
• Audible cyclical noise.
Proper design, manufacture and operation of the motor can prevent advanced levels of rotor sparking."

quote:
Reference 2 - " Electrical Insulation For Rotating Machines - Design, Evaluation, Aging, Testing, And Repair", Greg C. Stone Edward A. Boulter Ian Culbert Hussein Dhirani - ISBN 0-471-44506-1
"The only time that significant voltage can appear on the rotor conductors is during motor starting. This is also the time that extremely heavy currents will flow in the rotor windings. Under some conditions during starting, the conductors make and break contact with the rotor core, leading to sparking. This is normally easily tolerated. However, some SCI motors operate in a flammable environment, and this rotor sparking may ignite an explosion."

Based on the above, we performed the following checks before restarting the motor:
insulation resistance test, polarization index test, winding resistance (bridge) test.
boroscopic inspection of accessible areas through motor vent ports.

The above tests showed no problems, so we restarted the motor and checked vibrations and current signature. These were normal.

The moral of the story: What to do if you see sparks coming from a motor during start? If possible, I think it's conservative to shut down the motor for off-line testing and followup with on-line testing like we did. But sparks coming out of a induction motor during starting does not necessarily indicate any problem with the motor. It may be a normal occurrence.

Based on the degree of enclosure, it seems to me that externally-visible sparks are more likely on an Open Drip Proof (ODP) indoor motors than a weather protected outdoor motors (WP1 or WP2), and of course impossible for TEFC.

Any comments? Has anyone else seen anything like this?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: electricpete,
 
Posts: 2921 | Location: Texas Gulf Coast | Registered: 20 February 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
I have seen sparking but not due to start up tangential vibration of the bars and current flowing from laminations to the bars. Thanks for very useful info.

David
 
Posts: 878 | Location: Texas | Registered: 22 February 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
Hi guys,

Bit late in replying but what the heck.

Sparking of induction motors is not uncommon, GEC in the 80's and early 90's did a lot work trying photogrpah it and develop ceramic coated bars to design motors for haz area use - to be used instead of Ex 'p'.

IF anyone is intrested then I have a copy of the sales bumff and papers that go with this topic.

Tony.


Learn from the mistakes of others, life is too short to make them all yourself :-)
 
Posts: 5 | Location: northamptonshire | Registered: 22 June 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
Are you just "joking, Tony" Smiler

I can see where this would be a bigger concern in areas with explosive atmospheres. I would be interested to learn m ore about it. Do you have any more info you can post here?
 
Posts: 2921 | Location: Texas Gulf Coast | Registered: 20 February 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
Lol :-)

I'll have a rummge through the files tonight (job change so they are buried a littel!)

Toyn


Learn from the mistakes of others, life is too short to make them all yourself :-)
 
Posts: 5 | Location: northamptonshire | Registered: 22 June 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
Ok, found it - it is a number of articles from GEC alstom on the problem and the design of ceramic coated bars to caounter it, I had the please of working with a couple of the guys behind the papers, in fact some of them still work for Cegelec UK Ltd (the decendant of GEC alstom motors).

But I don't have clue how to host on this board but if you want a copy please drop me a mai - [edit] e-mail removed [/edit].

Cheers
Tony

This message has been edited. Last edited by: jo-KING-tony,


Learn from the mistakes of others, life is too short to make them all yourself :-)
 
Posts: 5 | Location: northamptonshire | Registered: 22 June 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
Hi Tony,
If you want to post it, make a pdf file of those articles. Any scanner will do a super job for you. Then:
1) Write the text of your posting
2) Click “Add attachment”
3) Click “Browse”
4) Find the directory on your computer where the file is stored.
5) Click the file
6) Add the description if you want to
7) Click “Post now”

Last time when I looked, the top output for induction motors with a plain cage was about 6 MW. The limiting factor was arcing between the cage and the iron on the startup. So there is a good reason for the insulated cage.
jank
 
Posts: 148 | Location: alberta, canada | Registered: 04 September 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
thanks chap - how did not see that button ! 1.6mb upload.


Learn from the mistakes of others, life is too short to make them all yourself :-)


PDF Docinduction_machines_for_use_in_potentially_explosive_areas.pdf (1,565 Kb, 20 downloads) induction machines for use in potentially explosive areas.pdf
 
Posts: 5 | Location: northamptonshire | Registered: 22 June 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
That's a great article. Interesting to see the detective work that was used in the early days to narrow it down to the rotor. Thanks for posting that.

Also interesting to see that rotor bar insulation is used on some machines to limit inter-bar currents associated with this sparking during start:

Page 23 of 40
quote:
It has been shown that insulated rotor bars (Fig. 16) eliminate sparking due to inter-bar currents. It is considered by GEC ALSTHOM Large Machines that insulating is preferable to trying to ensure tight bars as the differential thermal expansion of the copper and laminations will cause a deterioration of the bar tightness and natural oxidation of the copper will increase the contact retsistance. "S" type machines (Fig. 17) have such insulated bars.


This is 100% consistent with comments from Jan in the thread on torque producing force.
 
Posts: 2921 | Location: Texas Gulf Coast | Registered: 20 February 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Posted Hide Post
it is an interesting article - I was very lucky, when I started my engineering career I had the chance to work with some of the people involved in the project, in fact my boss worked in the development lab with Roger Regan and to work with that sort of experience is truly invaluable - and of course some of the stories; they recall spending many happy hours with a hydrogen fill bag and different types of bars at high voltage trying to make them blow up Eeker
Tony.


Learn from the mistakes of others, life is too short to make them all yourself :-)
 
Posts: 5 | Location: northamptonshire | Registered: 22 June 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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